tish jones

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veritascara:

chocolatequeennk:

jaydelahaye:

hellostarlight20:

chocolatequeennk:

I have a question. I’ve always assumed that Martha was the eldest sibling, based on her interactions with Tish in “The Lazarus Experiment.” Her dismissal of Tish’s work accomplishments has a strong vibe of an older sister thinking her younger sibling is still too young to do something important. When she’s trying to get Tish away from Lazarus on the roof, Tish asks why she always has to try to ruin things for her. All of their interactions feel like an older sister used to taking care of the younger, and the younger resenting that her older sister doesn’t treat her like an adult.

However, in at least two of the novels, Martha refers to Tish as her older sister. I looked up her Wikia page, and they don’t have an episode reference for that fact, which means it’s only ever stated in the books.

My question is this: Is it possible the books got it wrong? The only way in which Martha acts like a middle child is the role she takes as family mediator. Every other thing I see in her speaks strongly of a firstborn child. Is there something I’m missing?

I always thought she was the middle sister, the peacemaker. Caught between Tish siding with her mom and Leo siding with her dad.(Smith & Jones) I admit I don’t read the novels and usually don’t take canon from them from the TARDIS wiki page, but it’s always been my assumption it’s Tish, Martha, and Leo. Also, just b/c Martha is younger doesn’t mean she can’t harp on Tish if Tish hasn’t found her purpose in life but flits from job to interest to whatever. Martha is dedicated & knows what she wants, older or younger, that doesn’t mean Tish has yet.

Birth order doesn’t matter, personality does.

For sure; I’m the oldest and my life is soooo much less together than my younger sister’s.

And I’ve always gone with Martha as a middle child too.

I think it’s the rooftop scene that really makes me lean toward Martha being older. Every line of Tish’s up until she sees Lazarus change is resentful of Martha telling her what to do and always trying to control her life. Which as you say @hellostarlight20, could be because Martha’s life is more put together that her sister’s, except Tish seems to have a decent handle on her life.

Martha as the family peacekeeper could stem from the same nurturing personality that made her want to be a doctor. She wants people to be happy and healthy, and constant family strife is bad for everyone.

My general approach is to accept book/audio information as canon as long as nothing from an episode contradicts it. That’s why I like the books–they fill in some of those blanks. This one contradicts my head canon though, and I’m having a hard time reconciling the two.

While I used to think Martha was the oldest for some of her personality traits (high achievement, etc.), from a chronological perspective, it makes much more sense that she’s the middle child. Tish is already out of college and working on her career. Martha is still in uni (and remember, med school in Britain is a five year undergrad program, so Martha’s not likely older than 23), and we know for certain that Leo, the youngest, is 21.

Martha’s middle child tendencies do show up a few times. We see a lot of instances where she tends to have that middle child self-centeredness and desire to get attention. This could also be part of why she’s dismissive of Tish’s career. She’s spent much of her life fighting for attention, and as a med student (which is super competitive to get into), she feels she deserves it, but never really knows how to ask for it, so she uses some passive-aggressive tactics.

Also Martha definitely performs that classic peace-keeping/harmonizing role in her family. She is quite literally caught in the middle there.

I also second @jaydelahaye’s statement. I’m the oldest, but my brother, who has always been the quintessential middle child in our family, is the one who is getting a PhD and who is neurotically organized with his life. And I can’t tell you how many times I told him he was ruining things for me and I hated him when we were kids. (We get along great now). Martha and Tish seem to still have a good deal of that sibling tension between them.